Does anyone have a follow up that confirms or denies my claim? Was sort of worried about how it would run with an 11.5" barrel and mismatched ramps, but it sounds like it should be good to go either way. which is bad combo. so it is better to have an upper reciever that's designed for non-m4 feed ramps since you can put in standard barrels right? As suggested, its best to match the upper and barrel extension no worries that way. With the increased use of larger-diameter cased cartridges, the M4 feed ramps are proving their values when using them in those cartridges. Not all mil-spec features advertised on the product information are the real mil-specs. You can modify the upper, but bear in mind that the un-anodized aluminum surface will be very soft and prone to wear if your particular bullet hits it frequently. By By the time you made it work you spent more time, money, and effort than if you just bought a new barrel or upper. Having been in military supply, I know that what the mil-spec means: it gets the minimum job done for thousands (millions) of parts/systems. Konza Defender M-LOK 5.56 16" Rifle 1x7 FEATURES: 16" 4150 Nitride 1x7 5.56 Barrel T-Marked Upper with M4 Feed Ramps Steel Micro Gas Block, and Carbine Length Gas Tube 15" 7075 T6 Aluminum Free Float M-LOK Hand Guard A2 Muzzle Break BCG is an M16 Style Nitride QPQ Finish Charging Handle Mil-Spec 6 Position Mil-Spec Diameter Stock I'd get jams from bullets hitting the back of the upper so I took a small round file and made the M4 ramps in the upper. So, what youre saying is that an M16 upper (not M4 cut) will work with either barrel, but an M4 cut upper will only work with an M4 cut barrel. The leading cause that leads to the development of the M4 feed ramp is the gas pressure from the carbine gas system that is increasing along with a high cyclic rate. Mil-spec is good for the masses, and if you want the job done it is a great start. What is an m4 feed ramp? Feedramps, proper staking of castle nuts, forward assist (yep went there)S-happens seen it. Product Details Douglas 18" Flat Dark Earth Cerakoted 416 stainless steel barrel with 1-7 twist and M4 feed ramps. Higher pressure equte to parts (bcg, buffer, buffer spring, ROUNDS, etc) experiencing much higher wear/tear. Being a Newbie AR owner ((Ive been an avid gun owner for nearly 50 years), I appreciate the information and visual aids that Im sure will be a big help in enjoying and using this gun platform. I built the upper using a Mega upper with a Compass Lake 18" barrel. In this episode of Gun Stock Reviews, we look at the difference between M4 Ramps and the old standard ramps of the past. If your magazines are set up correctly, and the feed lip edges polished smooth, each round fed from the magazine will go directly into the chamber. I didn't forsee that we'd ever see the day when replacement parts would be so hard to get. 338 and others not the .308 76251 or 6.5 creedmore which o think should have a.30cal feed ramp.? You also repeated yourself. If you have a m4 ramped upper but not barrel you can cause problems as there's a lip of steel barrel extension in the way that can cause feeding problems. The A2's are pretty reliable guns, but trashed mags can cause them to have malfunctions also. A couple of times I ended up with the OK set up from the picture above. Instead, I just loaded up each mag with two rounds, and pushed the rounds forward by hand until the tip of . Is one better than the other? colt A1E1 733 uppers didn't have extended carbine feedramps ? All this basically means is that the ramps continue from the barrel extension down through the upper receiver tonthe magazine. The barrel is supposed to have the M4 feed ramps. Theres a bit more to it than just polishing. The M4 receiver feed ramps are cut at a steeper angle and, as a result, extend down into the receiver wall. what I fear the most is having an m4 ramp upper and then getting a barrel with a rifle ramp. UPPER RECEIVER: AR-15 Mil-Spec Machined out of 7075-T6 Forged Aluminum, M4 Feed Ramps, Cerakoted Magpul Flat Dark Earth (FDE) Color with Forward Assist and Ejection Port Cover Installed BARREL: 22 inch, 223 Wylde Caliber, 4150 CMV, 1:7 Twist, Heavy Bull Barrel Profile, Straight Fluted, Melonite/Nitride Finish - made for us by Tactical Kinetics HAND I suggest you get a rifle receiver. #2. Factory said its fine . I notice that's a Gibbz (or Gibbz-type) upper. Guess what? Get The Best Trigger Pull Gauges To Make Every Shot Count. The barrel Throat is the second most critical component after angles and should be polished with utmost care. M4 feed ramps were created during the development of the xM4 carbine for the original Army requirement of a carbine rifle that used the then current M16A2 upper receiver, 14.5" Barrel and had featured a collapsible sliding stock. Display as a link instead, You cannot paste images directly. The only other time it seems to help is if the mag is feeding the rounds with the bullet slightly angled lower than normal. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. Single Action and Double Action Which One Is Better For You? When you need to nail something you use a hammer not a wrench. The dimensions are different between the two, so theyd have to change some things to the feed ramps dimensions. I put together a second AR9 that is having a feeding issue, even if using similar parts as the first one. The M4 cut extends down beyond the edge of the barrel extension (has a scalloped appearance), and a correspondingly deeper cut in an M4-spec upper receiver effectively extends the ramps downward (they're lowered). When I function tested it the first time with live half-jacketed rounds I had the worst FTF jam I have ever experienced. Thats true overall and good to keep in mind. Previous. The angle is going to be key, alot of people attempt to mimic the angle of the barrel feed ramps, this is incorrect. If you consider this article useful, share it with anyone in need! To conclude, the M4 feed ramps bring a lot of improvements to the AR-platform firearms. I too built a .458 SOCOM carbine . Oh well, as I tell my lovely and understanding bride, guns are relatively free. it's the ammo and training that cost real money. Somwhere in the 1990s I believe, Colt designed the M4 feed ramps, where they took some of the material out of the upper receiver, cut two little ramps in it and then cut the ramps in the barrel extention a little further forward. You need to match up barrels to receivers for optimum performance. i have the rifle barrel. The rifle receiver, doesn't have ramps on the receiver, they are only cut into the barrel. There is no way to make a carbine barrel extension out of a rifle barrel extension, period, full stop. Another reason is that any commercial receiver and parts makers want to tool up to make upper receivers and barrel extensions, especially when shorter guns are becoming more popular. A4 Complete Upper Receiver - 7075 Forged A4 Flat Top Upper Receiver - M4 Feed Ramps Includes: - Add to Cart. M4 Feed ramps on barrel extensions are a solid example. Olympic Arms Upper receiver with rear sight assembly and forward assist and dust cover has M4 feed ramps $260 View attachment 1016575 View attachment 1016576 The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. M4 barrel to non M4 receiver is fine, but not the other way around. Editors Note: This article was originally published in January of 2019. Went back to the sellers website and found I was not the only one with problems. and add them to non-m4 barrels.? The best case is to have both an upper and barrel that have the feed ramps. 2. M4 ramps help in feeding in for carbine in full auto. The extension is the part at the end of the barrel that fits inside the upper. The M4 was the first (allegedy) carbine length gas system. Gas block area is .750 diameter. Watch a video about our Modern Series AR barrel: M4 16", SBN, 1:7, 5.56 NATO Barrel Specifications: - Caliber: 5.56 NATO (.223 REM) - Gas Tube: Car Add to Cart. AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. The only one I found is LaRue's upper, but it won't work with the hand guard I'm using (Geissele MKIII). This is a big tip, by the way, for pistol-caliber ARs. AAC and anybody else that has any reasonable expectation of quality and reliability use an M4 feed ramp. . The M4 ramps, if I am not mistaken, were originally made to help reduce malfunctions on the M4 carbine. so im thinking I might as well just get the unramp upper. Then you can get a regular rifle barrel for the upper with no ramps. Your email address will not be published. You are using an out of date browser. I've seen that pic, it is a good reference. If you aren't 110% comfortable with doing the job, and you do not have all the tools and equipment to do it properly, then have a smith do it for you. I'll probably build a pistol out of this one. Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. from my service in the 70s to my personal weapons, all of my ARs are early 1970 slab sided Colt SP1s. If I was concerned with precision, I would seek out parts from well-known gun makers and customizers Baer comes to mind, Hart barrels, etc etc. This includes M4 feed ramps, barrel nut, front sight tower and sight post, and -28 threads for a muzzle device. My factory JP CTR-02 has the appearance of the bottom right picture in the post above, M4 barrel extension in a rifle receiver, and there is not a mark on the aluminum under the barrel extension. I'm assuming that you only need the ramps from one or the other. All Rights Reserved. Its a miracle! I wont buy a barrel that isnt a wylde 223 556 but Im only now noticing. Which Model Colt 1911 is For Me? Add 3% to the total cost for credit card purchases. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. The mil actually only specs M4 feed ramps for use in its M4s. This is one time it's better to go a little too far than to leave an edge for the . I checked what I have now. ago Costs about $40-50 to have the feed ramps reprofiled from what I can gather. All comments are held for moderation and will appear after approval. 1 is a standard and the other for use with m4 feed ramp barrels. - The Shooter's Log, 2012 SHOT Show Special Report: Daniel Defense DDM4 V5 in .300 Blackout and a Factory SBR - The Shooter's Log, 2012 SHOT Show Special Report: SOG Armory Predator Rifle - The Shooter's Log, Surefire's 100-Round MAG5-100: The Highest Capacity AR-15 Magazine - The Shooter's Log, Throwback Thursday: Taurus Judge Range Report, ATI Milsport SGA 410 All the Advantages of an AR in .410, Ruger SR1911 LW Commander The Lightweight .45 ACP, Rifle Hack: Sighting for 100 Yards at a Distance of 25 Yards, Throwback Thursday: All About Bullet Grain. Hasn't misfed yet, through initial break in up through 1k rounds, and that's mag length ammo. I will attest that a rifle upper and a barrel with the M4 feedramps works just fine. Description Genuine 14.5" SOCOM, carbine length gas system barrel from Colt. Share it in the comments section. Any body need a anchor for a very small boat? Backing up a ton: Any and all AR-15 barrel extensions have feed ramps. If you have a bolt that you would like to use you are welcome to ship it to us for accurate headspace. I am glad to know that I need to look for changes in design and the differences in the A2 and A4 feed ramp / rails. And that is the important thing! Shopping with us is absolutely safe - you never have to worry about credit card safety when shopping here Share your latest AR build or photos from the range with #RangeDayFriday for a chance to win a new firearm! Can someone recommend or point me in the right direction of a good quality upper receiver for an SPR build that does not have M4 feed ramp cuts in it? If I have a rifle ramp upper and get the barrel later and coincidentally will have an m4 ramp. However, they do have M4 feed-ramps which is not clone correct. It's going to a gunsmith to be shortened and rethreaded anyways, can they just grind/polish the feed ramps to match or is it more involved than that? Machined from 4150 Chrome Moly Vanadium Steel and feature a QPQ corrosion resistant finish and QPQ coated M4 feed ramp extension. Earlfillmore 13 hr. pm me at BOG or PG, or get in touch with my number 09177542777 if you're interested. I'm planning on replacing my forearm with a Larue 13.5. I found the article very informative. Powered by Invision Community, M4-style barrel extension with Rifle-type upper. Using an upper with M4 feed ramps with a barrel that does not have them will lead to feed problems as it creates a ledge/lip that can catch the bullet tip as it tries to feed. So, what is the difference between M4 feed ramps and regular ones? On the other hand, I wouldn't consider them as a deal breaker, and they would not pass up a good deal with an upper only because it did not have them - the M4 feed ramps. A couple of times I ended up with the OK set up from the picture above. Seems M4 is all the rage these days. You wrote that much to make a point that should have taken about 100 words? So, an M4 feed ramp includes the barrel extension and the upper. You will be able to leave a comment after signing in, AR15Armory.com FN AR15 barrels are hammer forged using the same proprietary high-grade Chrome Moly Vanadium steel used in FN's venerable machinegun barrels produced to handle the punishment of . FWIW one of my rifles has M4 feed ramps on the barrel and no M4 feed ramps on the upper and it has functioned just fine. Barrel customizations are also available. You need to match up barrels to receivers for optimum performance. A shorter gas tube means reduced gas pressure, and we all know what happens when there isn't enough pressure to cycle the bolt carrier group properly. In short, if you have a Dremmel you can do it yourself. You can put a M4 barrel and non-M4 receiver together, but you can't mismatch them the other way. Seems like it should work to me, but be a real challenge to keep clean and be damned ugly to boot. Everything that you have on your side to make any weapons more reliable and work when it absolutely needs to is a plus. The barrel blanks available are made from 416 Stainless Steel. The M-16/M4 are great weapons. If you want precision, dont look to the mil-spec gun, look to the one that is popular in 3-gun competitions, at Thunder Ranch, etc. The Mission of Cheaper Than Dirt! Powered by Invision Community. For those who have actually done it will a new barrel with the M4 feed ramp extension function properly with an old school rifle-type upper receiver? When carrying out feed ramp polishing, it is crucial to prioritize the frame's angles, which is a critical part of the feed ramp. Interesting reading. You want them to match. Given that most of us dont always have perfect access to truly genuine Mil-Spec, mil-standard parts (those actually used in issued fighting tools), were shopping based on a little part trust and a bigger part knowledge. By using the M4 feed ramps for your firearm, you could pick up an increased percentage of the rounds, and feeding reliability would be improved. Barrel, sight and trigger work on most pistols and shotguns. "C" stamp and CAGE code available. Also, barrel life is relative. Some, me included, have said that the M4 ramps are a help to some of the larger-diameter cartridges in use, such as 6.5 Grendel or .22 Nosler. Modern Series Barrels. which is basicallly an m16a1 cut down. Related: If you are using a Ar rifle, best green laser sight is good choice for hunting. this is the barrel designed and profiled for the Mark 12 Mod 0 uppers and rifles. JavaScript is disabled. This USGI modification was done to both the barrel extension and the upper receiver, creating a longer and steeper feed ramp. For use by barrel manufacturers. Amazing what happens in a thread over a simple question. By my estimates, the tip of the bullet first hits the barrel extension about 1/3 of the way up the respective feed ramp on the barrel extension. There are several, but Steve and the guys at ADCO in OH are one such option (they use the Dremel method, but they do it right as I have seen several first-hand examples of their work and its performance after the fact). For this test, I used a Colt upper with M4 feed ramps and a SOCOM heavy 14.5 barrel, just like what is used in the military. While I've got everything apart, I'm thinking I just want to put an M4 barrel extension on. I'd rather just pay the gunsmith to make it work than hunt down another barrel/upper if possible. I think you will find that the tip of the bullet clears the M4 cuts in the upper receiver by a wide margin. Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited. So, lets glide down these lines below to erase your misconceptions about them. 3. Ideally both. You absolutely do not want it the other way around however. I use it for hunting dogs only. Barrel Length: 16" Barrel Material: 4150V Chrome Moly Vanadium Steel Barrel Finish: Phosphate Barrel Profile: M4 Chamber: 5.56 NATO Twist Rate: 1 in 7" Extension: M4 Gas System: Carbine-Length Gas Block Type: Low Profile .750" Diameter Upper Receiver: Forged 7075 T6 Aluminum Receiver Style: M4 Flat top with feed ramps Receiver Finish: Hardcoat Anodized Reach in through the ejection port and slide the on deck cartridge about 1/4 inch forward and observe the tip of the bullet in relationship to the barrel extension. There is a picture of the various options, hopefully another poster can link them. This can lead to a rare but odd situation; barrel and receiver mismatch. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. However, I have seen more than a few basement gunsmith hackjobs using a dremel, some Jack Daniels/liquid courage, and an unsteady hand that have made a total, unrepairable mess of the job. So the engineers lowered the feed rampa into the receiver. The Shooter's Log, is to provide informationnot opinionsto our customers and the shooting community. Semi autos run slower than full autos. 's blog. It gives a longer ramp that is less steep into the chamber. Brevity matters. 410 stainless is also harder and more corrosion resistant than conventional 416 stainless found in other commercially available precision barrels. I've thought about it myself, and I'd like to see test results if any exist, displaying what reliability effect M4 ramps have on other barrel lengths. These units actually feature the NON-F-Marked (correct) front sight base. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. For the purposes of this chapter, we'll call the new one the M4, and the old one the AR. And it appears that the bolt is slamming into the top of the bullet. These Mil-Spec M4 feed ramps are part of the original CNC manufacturing process. Looking For Bear Creek Arsenal Barrels Review? It's near impossible to replace the carry handle upper I have these days, and finding a colt chrome lined 20" light weight barrel isn't a walk in the park either. What's the difference? Check often for fit. I can still use the combination. $101.95. They . Im an old vet, now retired and looking to build some ARs as a hobby to keep me doing something that I will enjoy. 308 m5 using m4 feed ramps, which I belive are for the smaller round like. 16" Pre-Ban M4 Profile Barrel Assembly CARBINE Gas System About Upper assembly comes completely head spaced and test fired. They provide a lower, wider, and smoother entry for any round of ammo, whether its necessary or not. FN AR-15 5.56X45mm Nato . The manufacturer said they had sold hundreds of barrels with out problems reported. No feed ramps. With a larger diameter case body sitting down in the magazine, the tip of the bullet sits lower in relation to the chamber/bore centerline than with a .223-size round. 4. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. The photo shows the dents and the bolt lugs line up perfectly. The ramps are in the barrel extension. Some argue that, factually, its a step to enable a smoother feeding. The trust part is accepting claims of USGI-spec parts actually being done to not only blueprint dimensions, but also made from the correct materials treated to the same processes. Absolutely nothing to do with casing diameter, or whatever other weird sht you guys imagine. This is why you can use a barrel with an extension with M4 feedramps with a receiver that does not have feedramps, but you cannot use a receiver with M4 feedramps with a barrel with an extension with rifle feedramps. It is a tightly machined and polished piece of metal which guides a cartridge from the top of the magazine into the firing chamber of the barrel. Married pretty well with my Seekins machined lower. It is removeable with a special wrench and a barrel clamp/vise. I recommend putting any AR-platform firearm together with a matched M4 barrel extension and upper receiver set, just because you can. Gun smith said , not head spaced properly. May 17, 2008 in The Armorer. Full M4 feed ramps are on both the upper and barrel extension. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. . Our 6.5 Grendel Black Nitride rifle barrels are made from the finest 4150 Chrome Moly Vanadium and precisely rifled for high accuracy at a great price. Founded by Frank Galli in 2000, Snipers Hide has been offering informational videos, podcasts, and other support to its users in one location. -The Barrel MUST be removed from the Upper Receiver in order to use this Kit.-Never cut or polish the aluminum M4 Feed Ramps in your upper receiver! It is milled out of 6061 T6. So I'm working on my first build, and I'm a little confused. Ballistic Performance of Federal Punch .22 LR Ammunition with the Heritage Barkeep #1063. I read in Bravo company that there are 2 kinds of flat top upper. Clear editor. Its easier to add feed ramps to the receiver not so easy to add them to the barrel extension. Full M4 feed ramps start on the upper and continue onto the barrel extension. The difference between standard feed ramps and M4 ramps is easy to see. It has 2 ramps cut into the receiver to help the rounds feed into the chamber. Feed ramps being m4 or. So, I had purchased a 458 upper. True, which is why they're not even needed in semi autos. Both. Finding the proper upper receiver is your best option. However Ive built numerous ar15 and lr308 rifles and pistols. There are now thousands of upper receivers and ready-to-use barrels that have the cuts of M4 feed ramps. However, an M4 barrel extension is dished more so the feed ramps could extend downward, and then an area within the upper is shaped to match. The last is using the best and right ammo for the job. Upload or insert images from URL. CARBON-15 Stripped Lower Receiver A4 Complete Upper Receiver. This Kit is made to cut or polish the STEEL Feed Ramps on your Barrel Extension ONLY. Experts advise on 31 degrees+30 minus-zip. Home Firearms Figuring Out Feed Ramps. Ar-15 Manufacturers Should Be Avoided: Which Should You Buy? It's best to use rifle/rifle combo or M4/M4. http://www.ar15fornoobs.com/wp-content/uploads/feedramps.jpg. Costs about $40-50 to have the feed ramps reprofiled from what I can gather. America's Ultimate Shooting Sports Discounter, Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Pinterest (Opens in new window). Use this M4 Barrel extention with M4 feedramps. Thread: Adding M4 feedramps to A1/C7 upper. Recommend using a gunsmith this route too if you are not comfortable. An upper without feed ramps can be used with a barrel that has them as the majority of the ramp is on the barrel extension. M4 feed ramps. Feed ramps on barrel extensions are a good example. A feed ramp is a basic feature of many breech loading cartridge firearm designs. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. I recently built an AR9 (Glock Mags) that has been running flawlessly for about 3-400rds. The information provided here does not represent the views of Cheaper Than Dirt! Thats why AR10s- And Scar heavies exist for. The ramps on the regular rifle-type extension are cut just to the edge of the extension. Its fine to use an M4 Barrel with a non-N4 (rifle) upper but if you have the barrel already is much simpler to just buy a M-4 upper and just replace the upper the barrel is harder to build..I have even cut ramps on a rifle upper and it really wasent needed That is before I knew better.Then I guncoted the ramps before I found out about Aluminum Black treatment. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. One of the AR15 engineers under Gene Stoner pretty much said that the M4 isn't a good platform, especially once the gas port erodes a bit. I bought a .458 upper to go with it, with the extra internal clearance cut before anodizing. Installing a Luth-AR Rifle Buffer Tube and an A2 Stock #1041. The closest brand new barrel you are likely to find is the Windham Weaponry 20 inch 1/7 twist chrome lined barrel. Edited April 27, 2014 by Mark Gale By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. AR Tech Tip - Checking M4 Ramps for overhang School of the American Rifle 84.8K subscribers Subscribe 2.9K 90K views 2 years ago AR Tech Tip - Checking M4 Ramps for overhang Show more Show more. Load a magazine with two or three rounds, lock the bolt group back on your rifle or carbine and insert the magazine. Go back to writing school. It may not display this or other websites correctly. Questions on how to install your new BA barrel? He had more to say and added some more engineer and gun designer speak too. The first reason is that they are, indeed, better. can the barrel extension be bought individualy? Do you have an AR barrel or feed ramp tip? You can always buy a non-m4 extension and have the new barrel retimed and headspaced, but it will probably cost more than a new upper receiver. upper recievers and barrels are hard to comeby. Featuring hand lapped 1/8 twist rate button rifling and M4 feed ramps barrel extensions, the 410 stainless barrel gives the shooter the best balance of weight and accuracy. AR9 - Help diagnosing feeding issue. Create Account; Log Out ; Log In ; Wishlist 0; Shopping Cart 0; Home; About Press J to jump to the feed. Whether they materialize or not depends on the direction of the mismatch. I'd rather not spent the money to get it cut to the specific length I need, FSB installed, etc just to have it immediately not work and have to sort out then or start from square one with a new barrel.